Webinar on batteries and the grid

  • 07/01/2020 10:54 AM
    Message # 9072273

    Plug'n Drive is hosting what looks like an interesting webinar on July 16. It's free.

    "EV Batteries Value Proposition for Owners and the Electricity Grid"


  • 07/16/2020 7:56 AM
    Reply # 9106352 on 9072273
    Donovan Whistler

    Presuming that this webinar might be discussing V2G, and potential demand response targeting EV charging.... I'd encourage people to keep a watch on the recent introduction of Bill 17 to the provincial legislature. Opening up the door to power purchases outside the province. While targeting expensive commitments to purchasing domestic provincial Independent Power Producer supplied energy..... the implications could be much broader. 

  • 07/17/2020 8:16 AM
    Reply # 9108361 on 9072273
    Donovan Whistler

    Indeed this webinar covered V2G. Also potential value to EV owners of recovering some financial value from "selling" batteries to a presumed market for EV batteries for uses such as stationary battery storage applications.

    On the matter of getting value for used batteries... that remains to be seen if such a market might materialize.

    Ad for the V2G, the seminar was based on prospects that might materialize specific to the Ontario market. Due to provincial regulations and TOU tariff structure and program options that exist.... so not transferable to a jurisdiction like BC.

    The seminar presentation was based on many presumptions. For example, that the likely main application would be for people plugging into V2G connection points at their places of work. Prospects for residential connections, and emergency backup applications were not considered or explored. Noted was the presumption that V2G connection point costs were in the order of costing close to $20,000. And the "value" focus was predicated on charging under TOU rate structures at home during low tariff overnight hours. Then when at work plugging in to supply power to the host location.... which would be paying higher tariff rates.

    This seminar also missed a range of more likely scenarios. And one has to keep in mind that until V2G becomes supported by EV manufacturers as the norm.... V2G isn't going anywhere. Virtually no coverage to Tesla.... and developments that are indicative of potential future paths that might develop. Nor much attention paid to the subject of utility scale battery storage and distributed battery and solar PV grid connected systems.... again areas that Tesla is ramping up on.

    This seminar was a bit of a disappointment. Simply based to much on presumptions about future directions that may well be well off the mark. And for V2G to take off, connection points will need to be much less costly... in the order of Level 2 EV chargers.... and include residential connections.

    Regardless, the host website has now posted a summary version and full report version of the report just published for which the webinar was based on. Might be an interesting read!

  • 07/18/2020 10:16 AM
    Reply # 9110602 on 9072273
    Gordon Wong

    There is in fact a growing market for used EV batteries for stationary home power applications.  Many permutations can exist, with or without solar as the power source, with or without grid-tie, but the main purpose is to cover frequent rural power outages.   

    The V2G market is not yet targeting home installations as the demand is not there.  And EV owners prize their batteries and are generally reluctant to cycle them daily on the grid.   Since current batteries are good for only 1000 cycles in EV use, and maybe 2000 cycles as secondary-life storage, I would think that LTO or lithium titanium oxide with its 25,000 cycle life is the obvious choice for stationary power.  That's 70 years of daily cycling.  If you installed Toshiba LTO cells today they could still be in use by your great grandchildren.  

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